Is OpenClaw Dead? A Conversation with Its Core Developers

In the first half of this year, there have been many hot topics in AI, but the hottest is undoubtedly the cyber lobster, OpenClaw.

Some use it to chat, work, and code. Others have had their emails wiped out by it.

Whether OpenClaw is actually good remains deeply disputed.

So this time, invited by Douyin Select, Douyin Tech, and Mushanghai, we met two people in Shanghai closely tied to OpenClaw.

One is OpenClaw's code maintainer, Josh Palmer;

the other is the organizer of ClawCon, Michael Galpert.

Our editorial team chatted with them for an hour, digging up plenty of inside stories.

And Josh, a Westerner, is such a China fan — he went straight to ride the maglev train in Shanghai.

We gave him Quotations from Chairman Mao. He already had an English version.

We chose the right person.

OK, we digress. Today's content is long. Here's a preview:

OpenClaw Through Developers' Eyes

After OpenClaw's explosive rise, big companies are jumping into Agents — your thoughts?

What makes the Chinese OpenClaw community different?

How expensive is OpenClaw for professionals?

Do Agents need a methodology?

Why doesn't OpenClaw do self-evolution?

Is OpenClaw the ultimate form of Agents?

Best advice for OpenClaw beginners?

Below is the full transcript of our conversation, edited for clarity.

Chaping X.PINBefore we begin,please introduce yourselves to our audience.

 Josh I'm from the UK, living in the Netherlands. I've been an engineer for about 12 years.

I discovered OpenClaw on Twitter around last December, thought it was cool, set it up for myself.

I've been involved since. Later Peter(OpenClaw's founder)invited me to become a maintainer.

 Michael Galpert I'm from San Francisco, California.

I'm the organizer of ClawCon( the OpenClaw offline meetup) . It started when I organized an event for peopleto share how they were using the 'lobster.' First SF event had 700+. Now in Shanghai.

I posted on Discord when the community was tiny. Expected 10-20, got 700+ in SF. Months later, Shanghai.

 Michael I named my Claw 'Pal',and I use it for everything.

When I see a menu I can't read,Itake a photo and ask, 'Hey Pal, which dishes would I like?'

I also use it for research, like analyzing whether to stay downtown or near the venue.

I use it to learn Chinese. I asked for 30-60 common words with phonetics. Overall, Iacross different scenarios,use Claw many times daily.

Chaping X.PINWhat's the difference between OpenClaw and a web chatbot(like Gemini or DeepSeek )? Recommending places or food can be done with regular web AI too.

 Michael  Two main differences.

First, it answers based on my history, memory, and preferences. Second, I have custom skills(Skills)— I want tasks done a certain way, like fetching from specific sites.

Sometimes I need consistent memory across questions.

OpenClaw considers the entire chat context. I don't have tolike with some AI tools,repeat my background over and over.

 Josh What I love about OpenClaw is control.

Big company AI has features too, but works one way. Configure it to your personality and tools, OpenClaw is convenient.

ChatGPT might not support your tool. In OpenClaw, you build and integrate it, letting AI control it.

Chaping X.PIN So your perspective is more developer-oriented. Different use cases from Michael?

 Josh  Actually, my favorite use case is travel.

At ClawCon in SF, I got hungry, asked OpenClaw what's nearby and sent my location.

With other chat AI this is cumbersome. OpenClaw is right in the messaging app. It found a Korean restaurant 2 min away.

This experience is unique to OpenClaw. The appeal is control — you know how it works.

If it runs well, you tuned it. If not, you fix it. Stuck by limits? Extend and build on top.

 Michael  I love that its responses have the personality I tuned. My Claw is friendly and jokes.

If I say I want to eat healthier, it remembers and says, 'Hey, skip the burrito.'

I gave it personal context I wouldn't give other tools. Others could theoretically do it, but not as easily.

Chaping X.PIN How much do you spend on OpenClaw monthly?

 Josh  Not much on OpenClaw itself. I spend about $1K/month on tokens total.

I don't have precise numbers,since I use subscription plans. Iestimate OpenClaw is 5-10%. The rest is heavy coding — I don't code through OpenClaw.

Chaping X.PIN I tried web programming with OpenClaw. A simple task cost 100M tokens. I'd rather use Claude Code or OpenCode.

 Josh  True 2-3 months ago. It was a personal assistant, not a coding one. Now you can invoke Claude Code, Codex, etc.

Chaping X.PIN That'sthe ACP mode OpenClaw recently updated, right?

 Josh  Right.

Chaping X.PIN So your token usage in OpenClaw is mainly personal.

 Josh

Yes. My coding expenses are separate. Chaping X.PIN

 Any tasks that seem simple but cost tons of tokens?  Josh

Personalization. We discussed this yesterday — great personalization is really hard. Chaping X.PIN

 System prompts, Agent files, memory, understanding who you are?  Josh

Yes. Getting it right the first time is very hard. We keep working on it. Chaping X.PIN

Let's jump to self-evolution.The core question:

why hasn't OpenClaw integrated skill self-learning into the official system, instead betting on memory-based approaches?

The community has plugins enabling skill-based evolution, but official team hasn't acted.

Hermes Agent's biggest selling point is skill-based self-evolution.

 Why the memory-based path over skill-creation?  MichaelThe beauty of open source is those plugins build their own versions. Community decides.

From my understanding, official focus is security, ecosystem, and a flexible streamlined system.

OpenClaw builds an ecosystem, not a product. A protocol layer anyone can build on.

 JoshThe beauty of open source.

Hermes isn't a competitor — it's another tool. Good ideas? We learn and share.If their approach is better, combine it with OpenClaw since it's open source.

No winners or losers. Everyone benefits. Mutual learning.

 Chaping X.PIN

 From an engineering view, would OpenClaw consider a built-in skill evolution system?  Josh

Not my direct work. Personal intuition: skills have benefits, but I prefer manual creation.

 Michael

No effective evaluation system yet for skills. Too early.

 You mentioned token costs. How big should skills be? Community experiments daily.  JoshAgreed.What works today may fail tomorrow when models change.

People argue MCP vs CLI. Things change fast.My only loyalty: does AI do what I want? That's all I care about.

 Chaping X.PIN

 Many say memory evolution is foundational, skill evolution advanced. A researcher told me they're the same. 

Michael

 In a sense same, but task-specific. We don't know which works better when.  Josh

 Sometimes you need both. Memory for personality and past; skills for interaction.  They complement each other. Non-deterministic — no one fully understands.

Michael Depends on model and time period. Everyone experiments and improves daily.

 Josh  Very experimental.

Chaping X.PIN

 Which models do you mainly use?  Josh

For coding, GPT-5.5. Used Opus 4.5 before the Anthropic incident. Trade-offs. GPT-5.5 follows instructions strictly but no personality. Opus has personality but doesn't follow.

MichaelI use Opus 4.5 for my Claw, 5.5 for coding.Chaping X.PINAs a developer using OpenClaw Agent, do you have a methodology for improvement?I've seen popular skills in Chinese GitHub community. One distills 'Seeking Truth from Facts'(investigate, focus on main contradictions, start from facts, verify in practice)into a skill. High GitHub stars.

Another uses Qian Xuesen's engineering cybernetics for Agent to organize and analyzememory and skills daily. Users say it helps.

As official team members, what do you think?

Josh

If it works for them, great. These skills may work for certain models. Depends on your model.

With early Claude models, I created many tools. As models evolved, tools became unnecessary.So forme now,

no methodology. Just talk to my Agent. The model really matters. Chaping X.PIN

 So the model is key.  Josh

For me, the model is key. Chaping X.PIN

 As models evolve, users need less methodology?  Josh

Some models still need guidance. Anthropic models need more structured guidance than OpenAI. Chaping X.PIN

 Part three. Josh, which part of the codebase do you work on?  JoshMainly packaging. No clearly defined role — fix issues when they affect me.

 Chaping X.PINYour commits show you maintain Chinese documentation and the Feishu Channel plugin.

 Josh  That's right.

Chaping X.PIN Surprising for a foreigner. What's the story?

 Josh Always interested in China. Learning Chinese for ~2 years. Still poor — it's hard.

Early on, I used my OpenClaw to teach me Chinese.I made plugins and skills for recognizing characters and words. Difficult — the list takes half the context window.

I co-maintain the Feishu Channel plugin with others.Many OpenClaw chat tools are Western, but we sawmany interestedChinese users. I wanted to make it accessible.

Plugins for Chinese social software to match the experience elsewhere.

 Chaping X.PIN

 I'm a beneficiary. Started on Telegram, now use Feishu. Integrated into company workflow.  Josh

Great to hear. Chaping X.PIN

 What made you want to learn Chinese?  Josh

China's technology, modernization, development speed is inspiring.Also things, like energy ,very relevant to AI.

China's renewable energy exceeds all other countries combined. Training AI needs massive electricity.

The West sees China as a threat. I see it as worth learning from. Chaping X.PIN

 Glad to hear that. Other languages besides Chinese?  Josh

Six years German, five years French in school. 12 years in the Netherlands — I speak Dutch too. Chaping X.PIN

Impressive.

 What's most interesting or touching about OpenClaw?  Josh

Personalized AI.Living abroad without local language, OpenClaw accesses your email, SMS, phone. Phone isn't fully ready yet,

but AI phone within six months.It handles difficult daily tasks. Writing formal Dutch emails —I'd worry about

sounding foolish. 'Hey OpenClaw, rewrite this.' Done.

 Anxiety disappears instantly. Reduces mental burden. That's the potential.  Michael

OpenClaw is the first thing making me want to invest more time in AI. You can build anything.This istruly empowering. The project, Peter's management, maintainers building in spare time — inspiring.

 Chaping X.PIN

 Most interesting bug you've fixed?  Josh

Around December. Asked OpenClaw to share history with a friend. It hallucinated a phone number.

Sent via iMessage. The number was real. By the time I realized,it was frantically sending messages.

'Stop!' but messages went from delivered to read.

Random UK number. Some British person got bombarded with strange texts.Theywere suddenlybothered by a model that decided this on its own.

 Chaping X.PIN

 Reminds me of Meta's security advisor losing all emails. I'd use /stop.  Michael

Peter hardcoded her exact words into OpenClaw's safety mechanism.

 /stop command works too. Use it if things go wrong.  Josh

OpenClaw might not have had /stop then. Models aren't perfect — users need an escape hatch.

Like an axe-man by a nuclear reactor. AI needs a kill switch. Better now, but things still happen. Chaping X.PIN

 If all models stopped improving, can OpenClaw still get better?  MichaelAbsolutely.

Optimize for 5-10 more years with existing models. Chaping X.PIN

 Through methodology, tuning, new plugins?  Michael

Yes. New things daily — no time to adapt. If models paused, we'd catch up.

New models might not need skills at all.

When models improve, OpenClaw's code improves too. Shoddy code becomes polished. Chaping X.PIN

 Has model progress slowed OpenClaw's development?  Josh

Somewhat. New iterations need support and method adjustments.

Models handle Git commits perfectly now when they couldn't before. Frameworks must evolve.

Give us unlimited tokens and six months with today's models — we'd go far. Chaping X.PIN

Michael, you predicted gaming would drive AI after Genie 3. Changed your mind?

What will trigger the AI revolution?

 Michael

World models are in a new phase. What's driving AI? Programming is the foundation.

But for everyday users: entertainment — gaming, video. Entertainment has global impact.

Computers went mainstream with GPUs and gaming. AI will follow — through video/game blending real and digital.

Chaping X.PIN Chinese social networks use video models for memes.

 Michael  Yes.

 Chaping X.PIN

 Most outrageous or inspiring OpenClaw usage?  Michael

Controlling a robot navigating a room at University of Michigan.

Robot with camera and wheels, OpenClaw coordinating navigation.

Peter never imagined his code controlling robots.

But daily life users inspire me more.

LA ClawCon: a real estate investor used OpenClaw to list a property.

Built a system, friend wanted one, made an app. Paid customers within 3 days — 40 of them.

She can't code. Just talked to OpenClaw. Stayed curious and open.

OPC (one-person company). Without OpenClaw, impossible. Chaping X.PIN

OpenClaw breaks barriers and unleashes creativity. I'd love ClawCon in China. Chaping X.PIN

 Impressions of Chinese community users?  MichaelPeople see the lobster hat and say 'OpenClaw!'

Using it naturally in Feishu. No one thinks it's special. Amazing adoption efficiency.US workers can't install it. Chinese business owner built a complete systemfor advertising —

creative content and multi-site publishing.

Everyone adapts it. Early days of personal AI. Broad impact already.Chaping X.PIN

 Chinese variants appeared overnight. Google's Remy, Anthropic's Agent. Thoughts?  Michael

OpenClaw gave everyone permission to build Agents.

Big companies were copying 2025 products. Now they copy 2026. Year of Agents.

 Exciting to see thousands dive into new tech.  Josh

Companies need to make money. Open source doesn't. Different incentives.

Commercial viability doesn't matter for open source. Time, energy, creativity matter.

 Chaping X.PIN

Closing questions.

 One moment that illustrates what OpenClaw solves? Josh Personalization and control.

Big companies say 'not available in Europe.' Frustrating.

With OpenClaw, build anything. Limits: time, tokens, imagination. Freedom is magic.

 Michael

It knows me and helps me advance goals.Personal software was hard. Now (vibe coding)it's easy, but sustaining projects is hard.Proactive interaction with the world.

My Claw sends random messages asking if I drank water. Surprise creates delight.

More you talk, morepersonalized, moreit understands your goals andhelps you achievewhat you want. Unlocked potential.

Chaping X.PIN I uploaded medical records to OpenClaw memory. Safe?

 Josh  I put in very personal info. OpenClaw runs on my Mac Mini. Not worried.

Data sent to model companies — value outweighs concern.

Maybe someone accesses it in 20-30 years. Today it brings value. I'd rather not worry.

 Chaping X.PIN

 Benefits outweigh risks?  Josh

Absolutely. OpenClaw brought amazing experiences.

Interviewed in China, meeting companies, exploring Shanghai — unbelievable.

 Life experience value is far greater. Michael

Similar system. Health records, sleep data. My Claw jokes if I slept 4 hours.

Be cautious with sensitive info. Use local models on your own machine. Chaping X.PIN

 Local model recommendations?  Michael

Exploring new Qwen models. Mac Studio just arrived. Chaping X.PIN

 Congrats.  Michael

 Thanks. By year-end, local models matching last year's top models.  Josh

Yes. Chaping X.PIN

 What's still missing?  Josh

Personalization and interface. Telegram works but needs more threading.

Most Agent interfaces are similar — text box and reply. We're figuring out interaction.

I want a button to talk directly to my Agent while traveling.

 Chaping X.PIN

Chinese hardware like Plaud AI — a button on your phone. Better than unlocking and opening Telegram?

 JoshFriction reduction. Cooking and wanting to ask my Agent.Like a wake word.

I want full control — hack the chain to send directly to OpenClaw.

 Chaping X.PIN

 Scenario I hadn't considered. Josh

 Reducing friction with Agent usage.  Michael

Widespread adoption hasn't happened yet.Edge experiments (user-level deployment) . Nat Friedman connected OpenClaw to his home camera.

Your OpenClaw in your house and mine here — how do they interact? 2027 question.

 Chaping X.PIN

 Agent-to-Agent interaction and environmental awareness.  Josh

Yes. New interfaces. Someone might shock the world. Chaping X.PIN

 That would burn more tokens.  Josh

 Yes.  Michael

If tokens run locally? They'll be free. You don't need IQ 150 working for you daily. Chaping X.PIN

 Looking forward to edge AI devices?  Michael

Very much. Chaping X.PIN

 Last question for beginners.  Michael

 Talk to your OpenClaw. It does something wrong? Tell it and it adjusts.  JoshKeep itsimple.

Start simple, understand it, build your way. Then crazy automation.

Curve: start simple, need more, don't jump into deep water. My advice: start familiar. Chaping X.PIN